Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

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rdesranleau
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Jun 2004, 08:38

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by rdesranleau » 16 Nov 2004, 12:43

This has been happening for over a year now and I still haven't figured it out!

We get a file and when we distill it, any typographer's apostrophe set in Times Bold (including Times Bold, Italic) gets replaced with a latin capital O with tilde ()!

For example:

This isnt supposed to happen.

becomes

This isnt supposed to happen.

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Here's the specs:
Compaq Professional Workstation Dual P3 xeons
WIN2K Profesional

Working in Quark 5.01r0
PDF Filter 2.01
Acrobat Distiller Professional 6.0.1

PostScript Name: Times-Bold
File Name: C:\PSFONTS\PFM\TIB_____.PFM
Type: Type1 PostScript
Version: 1.0

I tried the identical sentence, using the identical font in IDCS and the font distills fine (of course).

Also curious, a different font (ACaslon, for example) will not have this problem.

Even more MADDENING is this problem is common to the TrueType version AND the TimesNewRoman version.

Possible Hint:
When I fix it at the Acrobat level using PitStopPro, I embed the font from my system font the character gets replaced with a fat bullet. I can then replace it with the extended character (ALT0146).

BTW:
this problem persists with the smart quotes feature turned on
and also with the sq feature disabled and the apostrophe manually set with the extended character (ALT0146)

I have Quark 6 but am VERY wary of installing it (for obvious reasons)

Also: trying to simply work on this file from IDCS is not an option as the designer filled her layout with those stupid "faux drop shadows" (you know that little radio button that offsets the character in gray? InDesign doesn't have that option) :roll:

Anonymous

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by Anonymous » 16 Nov 2004, 12:58

Hi rdesranleau,

this sounds like a classic font substitution problem. My guess is that the Times-Bold font never was part of your print files from QuarkXPress and either got substituted within Acrobat Distiller during PDf creation of even misses in the PDF file too and gets substituted in Acrobat by either a local times-bold font or by a AdobeSerfMM substitution font.

What could be the reason for this? For example a wrongly configured PostScript printer driver. Another possibility is that you print via 'Adobe PDF' the virtual printer connected to Acrobat Distiller 6. this printer is configured by default not to send and fonts to Acrobat Distiller but to let Distiller let embed the fonts during PDF creation.

To check whether and if yes how the times-Bold font is embedded in your PDF file you should check the PDF's document properties and especially the document fonts. There you can check the embedding state, the type and name of the embedded or not embedded fonts.

The reason why Adobe InDesign doesn't suffer from a wrongly configured printer driver (if this is really the reason for your problem) is, that Adobe InDesign generates its PostScript code independently from the driver. So a wrong configuration doesn't harm the output.

rdesranleau
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Jun 2004, 08:38

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by rdesranleau » 16 Nov 2004, 13:28

Thank you SO much for responding!

I still have some questions, though:

[img]../../themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif"> [strong]rzacherl:[/strong]
My guess is that the Times-Bold font never was part of your print files from QuarkXPress and either got substituted within Acrobat Distiller during PDf creation of even misses in the PDF file too and gets substituted in Acrobat by either a local times-bold font or by a AdobeSerfMM substitution font.


How do I determine this?

[strong]rzacherl:[/strong]
a wrongly configured PostScript printer driver. Another possibility is that you print via 'Adobe PDF' the virtual printer connected to Acrobat Distiller 6. this printer is configured by default not to send and fonts to Acrobat Distiller but to let Distiller let embed the fonts during PDF creation.


I have set the PDF Export Options to Override Distiller's Font Options
(Embed All Fonts/Subset Below 35%)

[strong]rzacherl:[/strong]
To check whether and if yes how the times-Bold font is embedded in your PDF file you should check the PDF's document properties and especially the document fonts. There you can check the embedding state, the type and name of the embedded or not embedded fonts.


Within The PitStop Inspector/Font Picker I see "Times-Bold Adobe Type 1 Embedded Subset[/img]
I have even changed my distiller settings to Always Embed Times-Bold and Times-BoldItalic

Anonymous

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by Anonymous » 16 Nov 2004, 14:13

[strong]rdesranleau:[/strong]How do I determine this?

Hi rdesranleau,

by checking the driver's configuration ;-)
Go to the Windows printer control panel and select the printer instance which you use to print (very likely this is 'Adobe PDF'). Right-click the printer and enter 'Document settings'. Go the 'Advanced' dialog and check the TrueType settings:

You have to change the configuration in that way that
- TrueType fonts are downloaded as Softfonts
- TrueType fonts are embedded as TrueType

[quote:2064a6797a]I have set the PDF Export Options to Override Distiller's Font Options
(Embed All Fonts/Subset Below 35%)

You talk about Acrobat Distiller joboptions. I talked about the configuration of the 'Adobe PDF' printer. These are two totally different things. If you right-click the 'Adobe PDF' printer inside the Windows printer control panel and enter 'Document settings' (as above) you'll see a tab named 'Adobe PDF settings' (or something like this). Within this tab you'll find an option named 'Do not send fonts to Acrobat Distiller'. This option must be de-selected.

[quote:2064a6797a]Within The PitStop Inspector/Font Picker I see "Times-Bold Adobe Type 1 Embedded Subset"

Ok, that proofs that the font is in the PDF file but it doesn't say anaything about how it came into it. As I said the reason of your problem could be that the font wasn't embedded by QuarkXPress into the PostScript code but was later embedded by Acrobat Distiller. On first sight this might not make a big difference but it is. Just because two fonts are named equally it doesn't mean that they are really identical.

[quote:2064a6797a]I have even changed my distiller settings to Always Embed Times-Bold and Times-BoldItalic

That doesn't help at all. As long as you already said 'Embed all fonts' you don't have to put the fonts additionally into the 'Always embed' list.

rdesranleau
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Jun 2004, 08:38

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by rdesranleau » 16 Nov 2004, 15:24

Thanks for your patience, Robert, and I'm sorry if I sound like an idiot.

I had no idea that configuring the Adobe PDF printer and Acrobat Distiller joboptions were two totally different things. Thanks for the education!

I made the change to "- TrueType fonts are downloaded as Softfonts"

(to both Adobe PDF & Acrobat Distiller...maybe that was wrong?)


But I don't understand what you mean by
"- TrueType fonts are embedded as TrueType"
^
Is this an additional setting that I'm not seeing? Or ...?

[quote:dc85476fa5]an option named 'Do not send fonts to Acrobat Distiller'. This option must be de-selected.
^
OK, I de-selected it.

I restarted both Distiller and Acrobat but the problem persists

Additional info (if this helps):
PDF properties/advanced/driver: Adobe PDF Converter

Quark Prefs/PDF/Acrobat Distiller: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adob...\acrodist.exe

Anonymous

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by Anonymous » 16 Nov 2004, 16:16

[img]../../themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif"> [strong]rdesranleau:[/strong]But I don't understand what you mean by
"- TrueType fonts are embedded as TrueType[/img]
Is this an additional setting that I'm not seeing? Or ...?

Hi rdesranleau,

yes it's a different setting. You find it under 'PostScript Options' in the same dialog. It's wording might be a little different as I work on a German system.

It would be interesting to get a PostScript file from you which only contains a single line of text formated in Times-Bold which contains the wrong character (and some other text).
Could you try to print a PostScript file from this document to disk for me and send it to me?

rdesranleau
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Jun 2004, 08:38

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by rdesranleau » 17 Nov 2004, 10:01

[quote:e9aba96fdd]Could you try to print a PostScript file from this document to disk for me and send it to me?

You got it, Robert!

(tiny PS file sent to your e-mail)

Anonymous

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by Anonymous » 17 Nov 2004, 11:11

Hi Robert,

It's exactly as I assumed. There's no Times-Bold embedded in your PostScript file. If I send your file through my Acrobat Distiller 6 the job fails with an offending command 'findfont' because I configured Acrobat Distiller to cancel is fonts cannot be embedded.
As soon as I give Acrobat Distiller access to a local copy of Times-Bold (by specifying a Font Location) I get my PDF. And because my Times-Bold seems to fit to the Times-Bold you used in QuarkXPress I even get the correct result.

So you have two problems:
- you still not succeed in embedding your fonts correctly into the print file of QuarkXPress
- the Times-Bold font which is accessed by Acrobat Distiller doesn't fit to the one which is used in QuarkXPress

Problem two doesn't play a role anymore as soon as you succeed in embedding your fonts correctly into your print file.

rdesranleau
Posts: 9
Joined: 02 Jun 2004, 08:38

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by rdesranleau » 18 Nov 2004, 09:54

I'm sorry but I STILL can't get this to work

(please don't give up on me! Like I said, I've been trying to figure this out for over a year!)

OK. Deep Breath.

Why aren't the fonts embedding correctly into the print file, and why is it only this one (super common) font?

I know you said
[quote:dc9858beee]You have to change the configuration in that way that
- TrueType fonts are downloaded as Softfonts
- TrueType fonts are embedded as TrueType

And I made all the changes to my printer driver's configuration --- as best as I can figure:

Distiller:
http://img95.exs.cx/img95/5959/distiller.gif

PDF:
http://img95.exs.cx/img95/7254/PDF.gif


and BTW, the TimesBold/BoldItalic I'm using is Type1 NOT TrueType (although THAT has the same problem)

I've even hunted down ALL the times fonts on my harddrive and corralled them into one location on my desktop, leaving one, pristine version in the PSFONTS folder that is accessed by Distiller

[quote:dc9858beee]- the Times-Bold font which is accessed by Acrobat Distiller doesn't fit to the one which is used in QuarkXPress

Why NOT? It looks like there is only one version of Times LEFT on my PC.

Distiller:
http://img95.exs.cx/img95/2386/distillerfonts.gif

and Quark:
http://img95.exs.cx/img95/130/quarkfonts.gif

PLEASE help me Obi-Wan-Rzacherl! You're my only hope!

Anonymous

Times Bold Apostophe replaced in PDF

Post by Anonymous » 18 Nov 2004, 10:38

Hi rdesranleau,

Unfortunately I'm not half as good on the Windows platform as I'm on the Mac. So maybe I'm totally wrong with my statement here. But looking at your screen shot of the font usage in QuarkXPress, the more information field says the filename of the Times-bold font is TIB_____.PFM. .PFM file are only metric (PostScript Font Metric) files which do not contain the outline description of the font glyphs. Could it be that you're missing the .PFB file which contains the actual PostScript font?

may the force be with you ;-)

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